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She lives alone by her own choice but needs errands done, doctor visits, shopping etc done for her. You do these things and instead of a thank you, you get asked to do 5 more things on her list, and she is selfish, self centered, doesn't care what you need to do in your own life, is often mean, but can turn on a dime and be "Nice" for just a little while enough to draw you back in. If the temporary "nice" act doesn't work, then she pulls out her bag of tricks...which usually involves the "guilt" trips, or if that doesn't work, she talks bad about you to your siblings and such. Sometimes she does a bold faced lies to draw you in or to shame you back into her corner. She is so manipulative and abusive, I don't even know what is real or not anymore when it comes to her. It is a nightmare. She has always been like this. She just happens to be a little worse now that she has turned 80. It hurts to be around her, and it hurts to try to create some space because she feels like I am an "extension" of herself to be bullied and bossed around. Like she is entitled to do this I know I have a duty to care for my elderly mother but she really makes it excruciatingly difficult. . I feel burnt out by her and feel as if I have PTSD symptoms. I feel like I am sinking into quick sand. It is a no win situation. It breaks my heart. I want to help her, but she is literally making me ill in body mind and soul. Do we owe that to our parents? How do you stop the madness with out having to cut her off altogether. I really can't do that anyway cause I know she needs me but she is very abusive and unrelenting in her demands . She is all absorbing of my time, health and energy. I am burnt out now and just sad over this whole thing. My siblings are of minimal help. That is a given even though I told them how exhausted I am. I just can't keep up this pace anymore.

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You set your boundaries and realize this is a person who CAN NOT AND WILL NOT CHANGE. This personality disorder is insidious and defensive and the level of denial is un- beatable. All you can do is detach and make yourself some free space out of the scope of the Black Hole that is the Narcissistic person. They are angry and selfish and sad and deeply confused and even a trained therapist has trouble handling them...Everything is the other persons fault.

Do not make yourself crazy by trying to "figure her out" or help her. This disorder is profoundly entrenched and near impossible to fix especially after a lifetime of it. Put your needs first get away, get help from outside sources,,maintain your balance and sense of sanity. Calling her on her crap will usually get and angry blaming response. You may love this person but you don't need to make yourself ill caring form them. Use social services and medical assistance where ever you can and remember you deserve to be treated with respect and love. You are not a machine, a doormat or a child who "owes" there parent something. Do what needs to be done, help where you must but stay out of the pull back into crazy.
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I would highly recommend that you have your Mom hire a paid caregiver to come in once a week. This will give your Mom someone else to interact with. A senior's world becomes so small as they age. Since you are in her sites you get all the grief and frustration that she would normally spread out among others. So get out of her way - even if it is for a short time. Paid caregivers charge about $19./hr where I live. It really helps pick up the slack when they come in to help Mom once and awhile.
Also, you need to start setting limits. Tell your Mom, "I can do this today, the other things will have to wait." My Mom, while appreciative of what I do, got into a bad habit of saving up all these "things" she needed doing when I came over. I never got to visit with her, it was just a series of "do this, I need that..." So I let her know that I was her daughter, not the unpaid help and that once and awhile I would just like to visit with her. That seemed to help.
Good luck to you...I hope these suggestions help a little...remember: you are always in control.
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First, you did not cause your mother to be how she is. Second, you cannot control her. Third, you cannot fix her.

What you can do is choose a healthier path for yourself by setting boundaries with practical consequences which I recommend getting a trained therapist to help you with.

No you do not owe nor does anyone owe to their parent what you are sacrificing like a martyr. She only needs you to the extent that you are useful to her which is basic to that kind of personality.

Get, read and use first Stop Walking on Eggshells plus the Workbook as well as Recovering from the Borderline Parent plus Understanding the Borderline Mother. I've almost read these books either with my SIL or to my SIL if I didn't also loan them to my SIL. She could hardly believe how someone wrote so much about her and my wife's life. Now my SIL is like a mental health Princes Leah and I feel like a very old Yoda or maybe another Jedi trainer of not such high stature.
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The first step you have already taken. You have come to the realization that your mother intends to use you up and spit you out!
Crowe is correct & I might add that you educate yourself in negative/positive reenforcement tactics. The older they get the easier they are to outwit. Try not to take this personally....to a narcissist ALL people are TOOLS.
IF you are going to continue to care for her.....you need to find out how to handle her. So far she has handled you & before it destroys you the tables must be turned.
I'm praying for all the children of narcissists. GOD protect us from our loved ones!
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I work in the mental health field and still feel emotionally drained dealing with my borderline personality, Narcissistic mother. It's been lifelong and before I learned about all of this (personally and professionally), I felt emotionally drained constantly. The books recommended earlier in this thread are excellent. I have dealt with my mother issues in therapy years ago and learned to let her go (via a type of death/loss of the dream of a mother I never had) and now respond to her only in very basic ways. I do not react by trying to argue with her. I simply say what I will or won't do for her when she issues her demands. So she pouts and gives me the cold, silent treatment...so be it. She has yelled and told me to go to hell. Whatever. She will be 93 in a couple of months. She has way outlived her welcome but clearly she is still as mean as she always was. In fact, she is worse because she has some dementia now and her confusion frightens her. When a aged borderline narcissist feels out of control of her world, that person gets worse. The best to anyone here who is dealing with a similar situation. It's not a joy ride. Find nurturing elsewhere in your life. Also, Alice Miller's "The Drama of the Gifted Child, is an excellent read.
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When I read about you...it is my life is a mirror image of it. In very slow but steady I have gotten my mom to accept a 3hour a month time with a hired caregiver. She goes to a restaurant with her. It's taken 3 months for her to accept it, for she doesn't want to spend the money, thinks I should do it with her. I live with my mom...it is worth it for both of us.
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First, get yourself some therapy to get them out of your head, Second, set boundaries for self-protection and the protection of your own family and not for changing them. Third, realize that you did not make them this way. Fourth, know that you can't control their illness. Fifth, accept the fact that you will never be able to fix them. Sixth, grasp the idea that the best you can do is to pick a healthy path for yourself. Seventh, hold on to the chosen path with the outlook that if they join you fine, and if they don't fine or else you will lose more than just your mind.
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The other option.......run like hell if you can. Depending on the state you live in and whether you are legally obligated. My mom has probably taken 10 yrs off my lifespan already, which is not so bad but enough.
How much can you afford?
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Hi,

I know how you feel. My mother is the same way. The more I do - the more is expected. My mother lives with me - She has her daily "vent" where she "whispers" how terrible I am - because I don't do enough. This still makes me crazy - but I have over the course of the last 15 years (yes thats right 15 years) learned this - I tell her what "errands" I will do for her on what day - doctors appointments are grouped together - so I'm not running around everyday - and I told her point blank that she was mean to me - and I remind her when she falls back into the ritual - it isnt easy - my siblings are out of state and according to my mother are so caring because they call her once a week and ask her to call them once a week (it's on my dime that she calls too) I've been there - try elder services in your area or the local social security office - they do offer errand running and companionship that might help ease your burden. However - You do have to tell her no - that it is not possible for you to cater to her whims. Its hard, you feel such guilt - but you have a life too.
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I am living with an 84 year old borderline personality, narcissistic father with Tourettes syndrome with ocd to boot. I just stared a thread to get resources. Can any of you give me a clue. I am at a loss as to ow to best care for him and not loose my sanity and marriage in this dark and hateful place he resides....Help anyone..
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First at eighty they've earned the right to be self centered. You speak in terms as if she has been properly diagnosed. It sounds like family counseling is in order. Hire someone to give you specific days off. I'm so sorry your have such difficulties. Be honest with her. You are only one person.
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den2007,

purchase and read The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder: New Tools and Techniques to Stop Walking on Eggshells by Randi Kreger

When Someone You Love Has Borderline Personality Disorder: How to Repair the Relationship by Valerie Porr

go to BPD Central Online Community for Family Members with a Borderline Loved One http://bpdcentral.com There is an anonymous support group there for people staying in their relationship with a spouse who has BPD
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2 books that have recently helped me with my similar situation:
* Coping with your difficult older parent
* Working with toxic older adults
Both books are available through Amazon.com and are pretty inexpensive if bought used. -Leslee
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Thank you very much. I'll check those out.
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To all children of Ns I am trying to set boundaries but my sister thinks I am being selfish my mother has always manipulated me with guilt I can't take it anymore
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Pzerjav, evidently your sister needs to work on her own boundaries or else she would understand that you are not being selfish. People like your mother emotionally blackmail their children with F.O.G., i.e. Fear, Obligation and Guilt. Don't take it anymore. You didn't make her that way. You can't control her nor can you fix her. All you can really do is to put yourself on a healthy path of taking better care of you. If she wants to make the same kind of choice fine, but if not, that is fine also. Question, is your sister like your mother?
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No, my sister is not like my mother. My sister was married to an abusive man (verbally and emotionally) for 27 years and has never really gotten strong. She has learned a lot, however, through me helping her understand that we did not cause our mother to be the way she is. However, I can do only so much. I do have better boundaries than she does.
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Karyn, No one earns the right to be self centered, no one.
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I've got a new headache now. A couple of weeks ago, Mom blew apart, accused me and my husband of being liars and cheats - we've never done anything for her - we're cold, distant, hateful, and abusive. She told me that she'd just as soon we never come again (she lives next door) because we've got "dirty little secrets" (??). OK - we've heard it before, usually soon after my sister pays her a visit (which she did), but now, Mom's going to the neighbors, a lawyer, the church, etc and saying the same things - telling them that we should be jailed for elder abuse, then telling them that we're keeping our distance because we're mad at her for being honest and telling people (EVERYBODY she meets, by the way) about our wrong doings because "as it says in the BIible, 'all things hidden in the darkness WILL be brought to light' and that's what I'm doing---bringing it to light so you can't hide your dirty deeds any more.". Our town's population is only about 400. We've always had a reputation for integrity, but now I'm getting a bit concerned. Our word against a "sweet helpless little old lady"...she's like a 2 year old with plutonium in each hand. And BPD - MPD -whatever, she'll do these things for awhile, then when another alter takes over, she won't be aware that she's done them...leaving a trail of destruction and debris in her (OUR) path. What can I do?
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In almost the exact situation, however my mom lives in an assisted care facility. That doesn't change much though. She was mad at me for something and didn't talk to me for almost a month, at first it didn't bother me, then I started getting sick thinking about it (guilt for
not checking into it more) I kept in touch with the nurses and they said if she's that mad, just leave her alone and she'll come around.
In the meantime, she accussed me of stealing things from her appt, ex: while at lunch, supper, out with her friend.
None of whcih was true bc I gave my key to her apt back to her with my husb standing as witness, she was satisfied with that. But apparently has forgotten.
Then called this past mon. and said she's done being mad and wants to go forward from here, *what about me?*, knowing the anxiety, stress, depression I was going into, the physcial therapy I was taking due to the all the stress and restless, sleepless nights even with meds, I let it go and started feeling better.
and then....
she calls one afternoon and asked if "I'd been over" (to her apt)
no, havent left the house..why? someone stole my hair pick and I thought maybe you'd been here.
.................it's not over
and I realize it won't be untill the end but I have situations I don't know how to handle.
She told her dr. she wasn't going to take any meds, I'm her health care administrator(?) can't think of correct term.
Even if I signed over for her to take meds, she's hidden meds from the M.A. before and showed me the stash she'd kept !!! This was was while in health care side. So who's to know whether she'd actually swallow the medication? Then she'd REALLY BE mad at me and more than likely stop talking to me.
She doesn't want me in her apt, to call her, and said she can't stand me. I realize this is the disease talking, however...during the three weeks she didn't, she talked to my husband on the phone one day and asked how I was taking it? So she DID REMEMBER.
I'd asked my neuro if they remembered their angry outbursts and he said no they don't, but I have a hard time believing him.
She's called once to tell me about the results of her cancer report and it was good, then visited about the weather, that was it.
I told husb this evening, I want to call and visit with her but I don't know which "MOM" I'd be talking to.
That sounds like boarderline schizophrenia, but who's to know what she's thinking?
She had this game going, when she'd call, caller ID showed her name, husb answered and she was all cheery and "hi!!" and when I got on the phone it was this very very low.....hi....just acting so so down, it's pitiful and makes me sick thinking about it.
I've not called her for just that reason.
I don't know what to do, I keep in contact with the nurses but she hides things from them and they don't have a clue anything was going on untill the day I called them.
Bc she "acts" just fine ...............
help.....
thanks..maure
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I think they are trying to thin the baby-boomer heard by subjecting us to our abusive parents. What can we do?
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Husband called his mil to see how she's doing, she gave some fluff answer then turned on me, (I wasn't home)
She said "what's she trying to do to me? make everyone think I'm crazy???? (I don't understand that)
Then went on to say I'd been to her apt again and moved some boxes, so happend h and I were to gether all day yest. It wouldn't make any diff, i wouldn't go there anyway.
So she said she's done being mad at me, then turns on a dime and accussed me of stealking something from her apt.
Said she wanted to start over fresh, new, no more hard feelings....yeah right, she's already proved that's not possible and I will not be drawn into her web.
She's evil, kniving, drivin, remembers things and it's making me ill.
I talked with my family phys. today and he said it's one of the most dfficult things to deal with, because of the unknown.
Not the answer I wanted.... ;)
AND she hides meds instead of swallowing them, she had the med aide fooled on health care side previouly to moving into her apt.
Something I'd like to know....it's been documented in her medical files that she has dementia, I don't know if she's aware of it. She seems to think something is wrong with me (classic signs), when it's actually her, but I 'm not even going to be around her due to the fact I've felt she was going to strike me at one oint.
Another day tomorrow.
My Best to all.
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I realize that we are a "sisterhood" and "brotherhood" of baby boomers who are unable to enjoy our own "golden years" due to the abuse of our parent(s). That does not make it much easier to endure and yet it's good to have a support group of "me too." I would like to ship all of these demented old people to an island and let them accuse one another of thievery and maljustice. I told my sister recently that it's a shame that our mother will die with no one really caring or missing the "her" that she became. Ours has been very much this way all her life but the dementia has tripled the behaviors.
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I live in Florida where the elderly population is very large. They all have alot of the same characteristics. Cheap, complaining about EVERYTHING, driving too slow, and thinking they can say anything, anywhere and it's cute. I will admit some are great joys. But as far as I am concerned, the Greatest Generation is not so great. Let's hope we baby boomers can learn how not to act.
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I want to call her and say "hi" but husb advises against it
as did nurses. However she called the other day and asked him
whats wrong with Maure? he said, o h she doesnt feel good, fibro and cold, she kinda hmmfhphd
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Hi Shirl,

I like the Demented Island fantasy.

I live with and take care of my 105 yo grandmother and her brain is definitely wired with "reverse polarity". Almost all of her endlessly hamster-wheeling thoughts are ugly, evil and accusatory.

One day I couldn't take it any more and I said, "Grandma, at your stage in life, don't you think it would be better to think about some of the NICE things that have happened to you?"

Her response was, "Like what?'

LIKE WHAT???

Well, how about this: she used to watch Chef Jean-Pierre on PBS every Saturday morning and then on her 95th birthday, SURPRISE!, my mother had rented a van and we all drove to Fort Lauderdale to have dinner at Chef Jean-Pierre's Left Bank restaurant where he personally came over to wish her Happy Birthday.

Or the many trips my mother took her on to Burt Reynold's Dinner Theatre in Jupiter, or one in Boca, etc etc. Even a trip to Broadway to see 42nd Street with Jerry Orbach tap dancing 20 feet in front of us.

But nooooo, she would rather think about the time her sister ate an orange and didn't offer her one. Or make up lies about our neighbors. Or me. Or my sister. Or even my wonderful (RIP) mother. Arrrgh.
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Narcissistic and demented folks live in the world of negative and entitlement. Having an elder like that who is 105 - - well, that is quite a load to bear!
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GAH!
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Wow, I have it made compared to CallMeIshmael. We're all
individual and handle things differently, you've done so many things for your G.M., it's sad she doesn't remember them.
My husb doesn't remember when his 3 children were little. He was involved in an electrical accident, had to have his left arm amputated and I think with all the narcotics and x-rays, did something to his brain, the same with Moms condition. She was in surgery for a bladder cancer tumor removal the size of a grapefruit removed.
She's had three types of cancer and survived all, but his dementia thing is litteraly making me crazy. I want to call her but don't know which "mom" I would be speaking to and if she starts berating and cussing I'll hang up on her.
The drs have told me not to feel guilty over this, it isn't anything I caused or can fix.
I read somehwere that it's called
"The Slow Goodbye" and that hits home.
Thanks again for listening,
maure
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wow. sounds like you are writing about my mother.i too, am struggling with what i am somewhat duty bound to do. but if a parent is really toxic and terrible, just must get them out of your life, duty is not relevant if they are destroying you..i have always loved my mother deeply but she has been so toxic sometimes that i have cut off communications twice, and negotiated with her therapist in order to renew contact with her...moved 2000 miles away to escape. i am once again bending over backwards for her at the end of her life....but must lay boundaries so i dont get totally undone by my buttons all being pushed or acting like a martyr for her.
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