Mentally She got 9 out of 10 Questions right.
The one she got wrong was : The Time,
She couldn’t see a clock properly without glasses.
After her operation/Surgery they gave up on her / they mainly ignored her.
She was denied her human rights:
Glasses for reading.
Teeth for eating.
Her watch.
Also she was Dehydrated.
didn't get Support Stocking.
Even her drip ran dry & carried on pump bits of liquid and air.
she didn’t want to die & was looking to going home. She was a strong old woman & the neglect & the drugs finally got her.
NHS & anyone who looks after people, DNR / DNAR is no excuse to Kill our old & disabled off.
shame on you all that have & are killing in the name of DNR.
she didn’t want to sign & didn’t sign her DEATH WARRANT.
She was just old and a little fragile.
I’ve read that NHS, Nursing Homes etc kill in the name of DNR/DNAR
Even loads of Covid-19 / Coronavirus deaths were DNR’s.
Where have you 'read that NHS kill in the name of DNR/DNAR'? If such a thing were true, they'd be shut down in a heartbeat. They'd not get paid and be out of business in short order. They'd have criminal charges filed against them as well, needless to say.
Why wasn't your loved one visited while she was in this terrible place? Was nobody advocating for her? Was the terrible care not seen by a loved one and reported? When my mother was in a terrible SNF for rehab, I had her transferred out of there and into a much nicer facility that had a great reputation.
I understand you are venting, but calling anyone 'murdering scum' is a bit far fetched. Have you called an attorney to represent you in a malpractice suit? If not, you should consider doing so to see if you have a case.
My condolences on your loss.
I think it is common for people in western countries to have unrealistic expectations of how health care systems work, those of us who have been there done that know better. Hospitals are increasingly focused exclusively on acute care (which they generally do really, really well) and are absolutely horrible places to be once the emergency is over, friends and family must be on hand to take up the slack, to question, and to advocate - especially when someone is too old or frail or ill to advocate for themselves.
May The Lord give you grieving mercies, understanding and comfort.
Do you have someone that you can talk to that can help you with your loss? Finding a way forward after a tragic life experience is so important and you have obviously suffered some serious trauma with this death. Please talk to someone that can help you, for yourself and for your loved ones memory, she wouldn't want you to be tormented.
You are angry. This is a stage of adjusting to grief & loss.
I hope your rant made you feel a little better? Get it off your chest..
One day, when ready, you may wish to educate yourself on how DNRs work.
It is about keeping people's rights - allowing them to pre-decide against futile, painful or burdensome interventions.
I hope you don't believe everyone should be attempted to be resussed in every instance, no matter the harm? I hope you don't believe mankind has the power to always 'save'? Life is not a TV emergency drama.
Tooth - I am sorry this happened to you and that you feel your loved didn’t matter enough to those who made that decision. I see she meant a lot to you - she most likely knew that very well. Thank you for caring for her and about her so much.
There we’re plenty of drs since my moms stroke that made statements or tried to influence their views and also ones who made their own conclusions when meeting her with UTIs. Is my moms journey a hard one - Yes! When asked if she wants to live or is happy with the decisions we have had to make for her - her answer is yes she wants to be here and she would have made the same decisions thus far. For now she is happy that she got 3 more years . Others have gone in early morning during UTI treatments to persuade her to sign one and then come to persuade me to do the same - and not once or twice but over and over - it is not okay. I do not have rose colored glasses on -I am not blind to our lives - I like drs who give me the truth so I can prepare as best I can - I am a communicator - I want to know what every option looks like - but I have also had more (in hospital settings) try to shove their opinions down our throats than not. When it doesn’t feel like actual helping families make hard decisions and feels more like “they are telling you what your choice should be” it does leave people questioning if they did the right thing. I know they see what happens during resuscitation -but Moms last UTI (she was out of it from the meds and infection and they acted like she wasn’t worth it) - to those of you who haven’t experienced those type of drs - be grateful - it isn’t pretty and it feels really wrong.
After moms stroke - she mostly slept - her eyes stayed closed but she answered everything with thumbs up and thumbs down in the ICU - And I mean everything from “did you pay your health insurance” to “is this the correct password for your computer and accounts” - she thumbs up and down and was correct on every one of them - my mom was 71 - lived on her own - ran a business and even though she was hooked to machines and couldn’t talk or eat - and slept a lot she still comprehended every question - after her brain swelling went down and she was finally in the clear - the Neuro took me aside and said “here is your moms scan - it was a large stroke and your saying she was independent so though she will most likely talk again - swallow and eat and probably walk she will have cognitive disabilities and won’t like her life “ she then said I wouldn’t put the feeding tube in” and go home with hospice. I asked more - I told her I would think about what she said and I would review her living will (I did listen to her - but it also made no sense) after she left I thought - “she told me she will walk and talk and eat and swallow and mom is answering every question I ask her correctly” - this is only day 7/8 and I need to give my mom more time to heal - I read and researched stroke recovery etc (and had been learning for days while in ICU) then the next day told her - I wanted the feeding tube. The neuro and her “undergrad followers” stood outside my moms room telling me all the reason she didn’t agree and how if it were her and blah blah then an hour or so later the case manager called me into her office to “speak With me” about my decision (I asked my husband - my sister - moms sister and granddaughter - am I crazy? am I making the right choice - we all agreed mom would want this. So case manager was questioning me and I just handed them her living will - it said yes to feeding tube if for chance of recovery and that I was to make all choices. I totally do not want my mom to suffer with life saving measures but the sad part is “I don’t trust others to make those decisions” for her. It does happen. So I’m sending 🙏🏼 - I’m sorry T.
The "she" you described was terribly mistreated by her medical staff. Bad things like this do happen, and I am sorry it happened to your loved one. Have you thought about speaking to a Med Malpractice attorney?
Before surgery, a person be them young or not young, are giving paperwork regarding DNR. I remember signing a couple myself before I went into surgery.
As for Covid-19 ICU you may want to read this article about the lengths that nurses/doctors go through when doing resuscitation. It is extremely complex and they bravely do the process. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7236686
first if she did get “9 out of 10 questions right” on a mental exam of some sort that is likely why she was able to make the decision to be a DNR. Unless a capable patient or their legal spokesperson signs a DNR for the file CPR will always be performed in the event of cardiac arrest. It is more likely that your friend didn’t want the quality of life putting her body through CPR and fixing the underlying cause of her heart stopping would most likely provide and chose to be a DNR herself. It’s not something the hospital can decide for a patient.
Depending on her consciousness and swallowing ability amongst other things they may very well have kept her dentures from her, they can be both a choking hazard and a barrier to air/breathing adjuncts if needed in an emergency. Dentures are always taken out before surgery and often held out for a while for these medical reasons. But if she was eating or cleared to eat solid foods, sitting up and breathing fine unfortunately they may have been overlooked like her glasses and watch. Hospitals, rehabs and nursing homes were understaffed before COVID now the nursing and support staff are more than overworked, it’s amazing they keep their heads above water at all. I think it has always been the case that the more a patients family and friends can be around to help with those things as they know the patient best and are able to devote their full attention to that one person, the better for that patient. It is a crime that the people who chose caregiving as a profession simply don’t have the time to spend attending to these things for their patients, believe me most are as frustrated as you that they don’t but when you consider the things that take precedent it’s hard to argue because you want those things to take precedent when it comes to your LO too. It’s too bad your friend didn’t have anyone who was able to be around to take care of these things for her.
It sounds like she had an IV set up with fluids to help combat her dehydration, maybe another indication she wasn’t strong enough to keep hydrated herself. That is a closed system there wouldn’t be any air in the bag or lines to pump into her. The bag is supposed to run out and they measure how much fluid they put in over a period of time and how much comes out so an empty bag not being replaced rite away is normal and not dangerous, though they typically do remove the bag the next time they are in the room and close off the IV line until it’s time for the next bag. Only certified people are able to do this though not just anyone who comes in the room.
I would be very surprised if many COVID deaths weren’t DNRs as well so many have been elderly but that isn’t what killed them. Performing CPR on a patient with COVID that advanced may prolong their life hooked up to breathing machines and comatose but that’s not the way I would want to go, nor is it something I would want for someone I care about.
It sounds like your friend was a strong, vibrant woman who had lived a full life and wanted to continue living a full life. Which is exactly why she probably signed a DNR, if she couldn’t live life her way she preferred to pass as peacefully as possible, CPR is not peaceful. DNRs don’t kill people they allow them to pass with dignity.
The thought that a facility wants to allow their patients to pass just isn’t logical, they don’t make any money on a dead patient, they only get paid to care for living patients.I know you are grieving and I don’t doubt that the care she got wasn’t as attentive as she deserved but I can’t think of any reason for a facility to knowingly kill her or how a DNR would be a method to “kill” or “murder” someone. I hope you can let go of the anger soon.
"Business. Many don't have the emotional connection with residents; it is just a job to them. If you notice at many of these places, where the administration area is, is away from the residents, so those workers don't have to pass by them coming and going to work if they don't want to."
Frankly, this is so ridiculous it doesn't deserve consideration. Your bias is showing, but certainly not your analytical sense.
We all have to be advocates for our LOs. Aides are overworked doing many other jobs. We have to speak up and ask questions. To tell the truth, this place does not sound very well run. Maybe she should have been transferred out.
She had Life taken away from her By the SCUM / Murderous people who were trusted to care.
The DNR was not agreed to by anyone.
they literally have no leg to stand on.
The NHS screwed up Big time.
Facts are plain to see She is just another death in the hands of nurses. Staff And people that shouldn’t be anywhere near a hospital.
But at the end of the day The death cannot be undone.
they won’t get a prison sentence.
I don’t think justice Will be enough.
The murder isn’t going to go unpunished.
Justice isn’t going to look like much.
Murdering Scum
Oh as i was saying.
They stopped caring after her operation and she died for no reason.
Its murder.
Neglect. Negligence Intolerance & They removes Her Human Rights.
I won’t mention the details of the true level of Neglect. Negligence & Lies about her so called death.
the DNR didn’t have merit Just like the so called care after her operation.
but they are KILLING in the name of DNR.
There’s more Covid patients that had DNR placed on them in hospitals without any one giving permission, And that’s what killed them, DNR not the virus.
There’s more illegal deaths by DNR and not enough people who care.
Every hospital and/or primary care trust has a PALS team. It takes time, but you can approach these people to raise your concerns and ask questions about the negligence/neglect you believe caused your friend's death.
Did you see your friend's "Respect" form? The reason I ask is that these forms detail what level of care any individual, of any age, has stated he or she wants to receive in the event that they need interventions when they're not able to make decisions. There has been controversy about them in the last year or two because, as in every bureaucratic system (which the NHS certainly is, as even its best friends would not deny), the strong emphasis on getting patients to complete them has led to too many reported cases of the job's being done clumsily, heartlessly, hastily, sometimes to the great distress of the patient's friends and family when, for example, they don't agree with the patient's choice of DNACPR.
Of course I don't know what happened or where this took place, but I would encourage you to make things formal and take your concerns further.
On one point I can certainly set your mind at rest, though. The NHS is not run by the EU.
My 103yo grandmother was de fibrillated in an ambulance on way to hospital. She did not have a DNR in place and first responders felt they had no choice. I wouldn't wish that experience on any frail, rapidly declining centenarian. But with no DNR... that's what happened to her. I think pain medication would have been more appropriate, even though she may have died out of her home. I'm glad she came home to pass a week later, under hospice care. I can understand mixed feelings about DNRs, even if you feel the right thing was done.
She got to the hospital, was unconscious all day yesterday, and died this morning. Lucky her, though, she got to live an extra day and a half AND with broken ribs from the CPR.
Thank goodness her wishes were ignored, huh? 🙄
When I learned CPR the first time years ago through work, the well-experienced EMT who ran the course explained it as such: If a person is dying because their heart stopped, CPR might work to bring them back. However, if a person's heart stopped because they died, you can pump on that chest until you reach oil, but you'll never bring that person back to life.
It's an expression that stuck with me for over 20 years.