Can I take my aunt to court to obligate her to be my grandfather's caregiver?

Jeyka4444 - You have had a few days to read through the posts, and maybe scan the outside information provided.

My main concern now is, how are you feeling? Are you feeling reassured by the concern expressed here? Are you relieved to see there is indeed a path forward to get you out of your unhappy situation?

Because you mentioned feeling suicidal, which I have felt in my life, I've been thinking about you and wondering how you are doing? Did you see the moderator's post, offering the number to the suicide help-line? Do you think you could call them just to talk, in a moment of particular desperation? I believe the phones are answered by truly caring volunteers, available to chat at any time of day or night. Just copied from moderator's post: National Suicide Prevention Lifeline (800) 273-8255.

How are things going right now?

Wishing you blessings & peace!

Thank you everyone for your comments. I have read them all, or mostly all, and sorry I haven't responded, I have my dad in the hospital and have been also taking my GF to his doctor appointments and doing a million things.

Some have asked me what grounds do I have to obligated my aunt to take care of her own father? Because #1, I was obligated. Without even realizing my family had planned since I was a child that I would be taking care of them, many times I heard them tell me this but never realized what it meant because I was so young and I was taught that we MUST take care of our family.

#2. I am not giving the same quality of care as I once was able to. As I mentioned before, I am depressed, suicidal and it's brought out a personality disorder that I never had. I am being spread thin, or burned out. When I reach out to my aunt, which I spoke to her again the other day, she tells me that she cannot take care of her dad for her own mental health and that I just have to ignore him and try to "get along" for the sake of my dad that shouldn't be under any stress by seeing me and my grandfather argue. But....if she would've stayed with her father that "stress" on my dad could've been avoided by not adding a HUGE load on top of an already exhausted caregiver.

Does that seem fair?

For those who are unaware, yes, I can be forced to take care of my parents and grandparents, and if I don't comply I can go to jail. I can be also forced to liquidate any debt left behind after their death. No, I cannot put my grandfather in ANY home without his approval, and he is well enough (clear minded) to make that decision and already said he doesn't want to go to a home. Nursing homes are NOTHING like the ones in the states, and in all honesty I don't blame him for not wanting one, they're over priced and there's constant reports of elderly abuse in those homes. I tried to find a nurse, they only work for 4 hours and even if I went to work to pay for one what I would make wouldn't be enough to pay for one. Since my grandfather has money, he doesn't qualify for a lot of programs, so we been told.

I find it rather offensive that we can be forced to provide care for an elderly family member, even when at times we can't physically, mentally or emotionally but when we ask for help we are treated as if we're selfish for even suggesting that GOD forbid a child takes care of their own parent. I did it for BOTH my parents and my mother in law AND my grandmother who is my aunts mom. Come on really?! Is that really too much to ask? Because the really messed up part about all of this, I can't work to pay my own SS so when it's my turn I have something to collect and I can lose this house if my grandfather dies because we have Forced Heir Laws and my aunt can take it away from me even against her own parents wishes, so just that alone is another reason she should take care of her dad since she was NO help with the years I spent taking care of her own mother. She is one that cannot take care of her parents but LOVES to bark orders on the phone on how I should be taking care of them. I've also spent years being belittled by her, so fuck her! So it's appalling to force her but not that I am being forced to the point that I may harm myself or others? This is the mentality we need to change, since we all know how difficult caregiving is and stop blocking anyone looking for genuine help.

Sorry if I am being harsh but some of these answers have really ruffled my feathers and I feel that my needs and health is being ignored as always. To those who genuinely took the time to help find me information I am so grateful for you, thank you! I will be contacting a lawyer since the laws here are different.

Also, to answer another previous question. No I didn't sign anything to be a caregiver, it was dumped on me and expected of me to do so, and to shut up while my husband and I continue to put our lives on hold for others.

Frebrowser, good work!   Do you have legal background?    I think so, especially since you provided a Lexis cite.    And I stand corrected.    Apparently a multitude of people can have standing.

I'm still kind of shaking my head, as the PR laws you cited are quite demanding in terms of family care.   Did you happen to read any background on why these laws are so demanding?   I'm guessing it's a handed down tradition with Puerto Rican families but became codified into law as some members didn't participate in family caregiving.

I'm wondering now if the "long arm" of the Puerto Rican government can apply the law to a family member living in the States, and/or whether or not reciprocity could be established for the GF in Puerto Rico and the aunt living in the States.  

Jeyka, at this point I think you might need someone versed in international law, and unfortunately and to the best of my knowledge, many of these types of attorneys are with the big, silk stockinged, white shoe law firms, although you might be able to find someone in Puerto Rico.  Does Puerto Rico have local and territory wide bar associations?    That's where I would start, and get lists by practice area, "international law" being a good choice.

This has been a learning experience for me.

If I am reading this right Gfather is able to live alone,, just wanted company? So you moved in to provide company for him. Did you move from the states to PR? Move out,, if he can live alone.. move back to the states if you want to!

So in filial law... which states laws take precedent if the elder and the "heir" live in different ones?

Like say the elder lives in a state wih filial and the "heir" lives in one that doesnt?

Wow! Who knew?

"Laws of Puerto Rico Annotated
TITLE EIGHT Public Welfare and Charitable Institutions (Chs. 1 — 46)
Chapter 32. Act for the Improvement of Family Assistance and for the Support of the Elderly (§§ 711 — 748)"

"§ 712. Duties of the descendants and their limitations
(a) It is the obligation of the descendants of elderly persons to contribute to their sustenance. Those descendants of elderly persons who are responsible for their support, in those cases where the administrative mediation procedure has not been effective, the court shall order them to provide a monetary contribution or as an alternative, to make a fair and reasonable non-financial contribution to their support pursuant to this chapter. The duty to support elderly persons continues even when the elderly person has been placed by court order in a care facility or in the custody of another person, or a public or private agency or institution.
(b) In order to make the obligation of providing support to an elderly person effective, or to equate said obligation, it is necessary to file a petition for support whether by the obligee him/herself, or through his/her legal representative, or a police officer, a public or private agency or instrumentality, a guardian, a public official, or any private person concerned for the support of said person. Any of the above may file a petition for support before the Program, or before the court, or present a request for services to the Program pursuant to the provisions of § 722 of this title."

https://advance.lexis.com/documentpage/?pdmfid=1000516&crid=33cedd13-6586-4c20-baf3-c035ec30a6d7&pdistocdocslideraccess=true&config=00JABkODU1MGI4OC1hMmRkLTQ2MGYtOGY1NS03YjVjOWM4YjJlZjAKAFBvZENhdGFsb2d0HiKld62itjBDGzN8H7lV&pddocfullpath=%2Fshared%2Fdocument%2Fstatutes-legislation%2Furn%3AcontentItem%3A5CFX-2N91-66SD-843T-00008-00&pdcomponentid=234193&pdtocnodeidentifier=AAKABRAAC&ecomp=q53dkkk&prid=d309000b-5df1-45cd-a886-fcd7e2b99c97

Yes, in PR, you can. They have some of the most strict filial responsibilty laws which include hands on care. I do not know how it works since Aunt lives in the states. Call an elder attorney.

Let's start here. It doesn't matter if you haven't worked since 2010. If you have ten years or more on the books paying into social security and are now disabled and unable to work, you may qualify for SSD (Social Security Disability) disability benefits. If you don't have at least a ten year long work record of paying taxes, you do not qualify for SSD. You can try for SSI (Social Security Insurance) which is a supplement for people who haven't paid into the system but are disabled. This is very hard to get these days because too many people who weren't disabled took advantage of it for too long.
Secondly, there is no way to legally force someone to be another person's caregiver. If your aunt does not want to be a caregiver to her father, then she doesn't have to. You do not have to either.
If he cannot care for himself anymore and there's no family to help out, then he goes into a nursing home. It may be different in Puerto Rico, but they must surely have elder care homes and even nursing homes. You and your husband need to stop being the caregiver. Put him in a home.

So sorry you are going thru this. Not sure either how things work in PR but I think you do share the same benefits that American citizens do.

I would have granddad evaluated either by Adult Protection Services or Office on aging. Tell them your health is now compromised and you are caring for someone else. You can no longer care for both. If you need to, let PR take over Grandpa's care. I think you do have Medicaid?

Your Dad. Is he on Medicare? Check to see if you can get Hospice in to help. It won't be much but they supply an aide to bathe and maybe some xtra time for u to get out for a while. A nurse checks in 3x a week or so but is on call 24/7. Dad will be kept comfortable and as pain free as possible.

I hope this has helped.

W/o getting into the details of the family dynamics, and cautioning that I'm opining just on the basis of what I think would apply, and not personal experience, I think there are two basic but critical factors to first address:

1.    What STANDING do you have to sue to force someone (i.e., your aunt), to care for your grandfather?   "Standing" is  a legal term addressing the rights of someone to undertake actions, more accurately and specifically described here:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/standing

I'm certainly not an expert on standing, but it seems like a basic issue that if you're NOT legally obligated to care for GF, then you can't be either forced to do so, or voluntarily seeking legal support to force someone else.  

2.   The assumption by others here that "force" is being applied to keep you in this situation and presumably be responsible either directly for care, or inferentially to locate substitute care seems to be a major issue.      I've read your post twice and think that one way or another, you've demonstrated reliability over the years, and perhaps that's lead to family members looking to you as first priority for taking care of them.    But have there ever been any threats to you to coerce you to care for GF now, or others in the past? 

Did you ever sign any agreement to care for anyone other than yourself, and inferentially your specific husband and children you might have?  If not, then you're being manipulated by the family. 

It's time to stand up for yourself, and that's what you're trying to do.   If you aren't comfortable facing them, e-mail and mail them that you're not able to take care of anyone else in the extended family, and that's the END of the discussion.   Someone else will have to address care for your grandfather.  

Do NOT let them challenge or manipulate you, don't take their phone calls or respond to e-mails or letters if they attempt to manipulate you.    Stand your ground. 

More than likely they'll turn against you, but that's not your problem if they can't take responsibility for one of their own.

And if Puerto Rico has local therapeutic counseling available, take advantage of it.   I don't know anything about PR's governmental options, or nonprofit organizations, so I can't make offer any suggestions on these issues.   I think one of the first priorities is to enhance your own self esteem so you feel more confident in standing your ground.

I wish you luck; you're in a challenging situation, but you have to have confidence that you're on the right path to refuse to care for GF.

(moving post elsewhere)

Hi Jeyka4444, 
 Caregiving is a long difficult road, and we're happy you have found the support of others here on this site. 
 However, there are limits to what untrained members on our site can provide for you. 
 Please reach out to experts for additional support and the help you need 24 hours a day at the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: 
 Call 1-800-273-8255

Hello, Jeyka4444,

Wow! I am sorry all this chaos has been dumped in your lap! The anguish you are experiencing makes perfect sense. I am so sorry you are having to juggle all this drama, but kudos to you because clearly you are giving it your best shot! Please don't commit suicide, it would obviously be a great loss to the world if you did. Remember: suicide is a long-term solution to a short-term problem. This too shall pass!

Personally, I did not find Geaton777's answer helpful at all. The assertion that "morally and ethically you should not force anyone to provide caregiving" completely ignores the horrible situation you find yourself in, having yourself been forced to care for people who are not 1st-degree relatives, when their immediate family has abandoned them! Not fair! Not "moral" or "ethical" at all!

I don't know if you can get a Court to mandate that your aunt care for your grandfather. However, I have a couple of suggestions. Quite often, an attorney will give a free first consultation. Show up to the appointment well organized, with all your questions, and you may well get advice to point you in the right direction. Hopefully, there are a variety of options the lawyer can suggest you can pursue.

Now, on the other hand, do you have access to money from your grandfather? Because if you are hiring an attorney to manage his affairs, your grandfather should be paying. You should not be putting out your own money for his care unless he is completely indigent, and if he is completely indigent, he can be made a ward of the State and put in a State-run facility. If the idea of putting him in a State-run facility is abhorrent to you, please realize this man is an adult, and made decisions over the course of his life to put himself in this predicament. Each of us makes choices for which there are consequences, and we alone are responsible for facing the consequences. It's illogical that he should make poor choices, then expect anyone else upend their life to rescue him from his foolishness. You deserve a good life, too!

In addition to private lawyers, ordinarily, too, there are often Legal Aid Societies, where young lawyers will try to help at no charge to you. I would bet there is more than just one in San Juan (I am in NY, but when I was growing up, we traveled to PR frequently, and my father's third wife grew up there), there are probably several of these around the Island.

I've been trying to get help for my mother, who is mentally ill but generally functional (e.g., she imagines neighbors are stealing things from her cluttered apartment, but she manages to pay her bills), for years. Slowly, slowly--did I say slowly?!--I have come to learn about resources to help. In the case of mental illness, unfortunately, a lot of places that should help--psych hospitals, for instance, and social workers at medical hospitals--don't. I have tried one option after another, and have been very disappointed to find how few professionals want to get involved. Now *there's* truly a matter of moral/ethical failure! When professionals turn their backs!

But lately I was just told of a consortium of lawyers here in NYC who specialize in elder law, who provide free advice. It's only been 15 years since I first started trying to get help! From experience, I can only say: hang in there, and keep reaching out, regardless how frustrating and even infuriating. Step by step, you WILL find help, just keep asking.

And the bottom line is: take GOOD CARE OF YOURSELF. This advice comes from someone who doesn't always take good care of herself, who notices how much better things go when she does! LOL! Last night, I got to bed at 11PM and fell right asleep, rather than staying up until 3AM or even all night just to get everything done that needed to be done. I feel so much better today than yesterday, when I'd stayed up the night before until 1AM trying to get things done, then read in bed until 2AM just to unwind.

BE KIND TO YOURSELF!

Blessings!

No, you cannot nor can any court force someone to be someone's caregiver. What you can do is contact a State social worker to see if they can offer assistance. You can also choose not to be a caregiver anymore if you really can't handle it. (It is admittedly more complicated than that, you can't just abandon your family, you would have to handle that in a certain way to make that happen, but it could be done).

I don't know what the laws are in PR but morally and ethically you should not force anyone to provide caregiving. Think about it: what kind of quality of care do you think they'd actually provide as they stew in resentment over it every day? You yourself know the toll caregiving takes on a person. I'm sorry, but the assumption of family-provided caregiving cannot be mandated by a court. Now you have to be realistic and look at other options for them. I'm not familiar with what is available in PR but perhaps others on this forum are. You have chosen to do a loving and noble thing in providing care for your LOs. May you be blessed in your life going forward and peace in your heart whatever caregiving arrangements are available.