The Caregiver & Dysfunctional Families: How are you doing?

Austin-- I could only wish to be able to get out of her space.. but its not possible.. she has made herself sick with the upset my sisters have caused..and I have no choice but to take care of her.. Todays battle was over her wanting to schedule another Dr. appt.(we already have 2 scheduled before my surgery) .. and that is fine.. I am more then happy to drive her to her appts.. but she will daily start a debate over she does not want to bother me and she can find her own way to the Dr.. a completely pointless conversation because Im her only option.. she goes on w how she didnt need anyone all her yrs..and she doesnt now ..blah..blah.. the reality is I've always been there for her..she has never driven..but if she wants to believe she did it different so be it.. but now I try DAILY to tell her life changes..and some changes we dont like..but we have to accept them.. well this is not good enough for her.. she will go on and on.. until it is an arguement.. she says its because she feels bad seeing me do all.. Yet,somewhere in my heart I think she just will not accept her "new" way of life.. so my whole house suffers.. I hate bellowing on here.. I really do.. I know thats why we all come to this site.. but wouldnt it be nice to just "talk".. I dont know about anyone else..but I often feel so very consumed with problems and negitivity that I know longer know how to have a "normal" conversation w/anyone.. I feel completely drained.. On a funny side.. when I read the suggestion of finding another space.. I pictured myself sitting in my crawlspace..spiderwebs..dust..soot..spiders.. the works..better then my other option..haha..

Izabella -is there any way to get out of her space while she rants and ravs and go back in later when she has run out of steam-if you said to her I di not want to hear about would that help-probably not but I wish I could make it better for you.

I just looked over the entire thread and it looks like some are either MIA, missing in action, or have not posted here in a while. I hope they are doing ok. This dysfunctional family mess can really be a burden and intensifies with cargiving.

I hope folks are not getting discouraged with their early attempts to detach with love, for it takes practice for those 'no muscles' to gain strength, but still getting hoovered back into their drama can happen to anyone.

just lost one long post to you izabella cause the cat deleted it - yes really and then did another one to you jessie and pressed submit and it disappeared.
I am going to type them out in a word doc!

I agree jessie - Izabella you got hoovered in again. there are ways around it. Better stop here before I lose this one too,.

Izabella, it sounds like you really got sucked back into it. Parents see their kids different than other people. We may know they are really monsters, but parents always see them as those sweet little angels they raised. It's probably hard on them when they get the glimpse of the monsters they can be.

You'll have to schedule another cook day that you'll enjoy. And maybe she'll stay off the phone. I would be tempted to incapacitate the line. :-E

Joan, you sound like you are where I want to be. I'm new to this stage of healing, so I'm still waiting for anger to rear its ugly head in me. I took my blood pressure a couple of time when I felt angry and it was high. Stress and anger can play havoc on our bodies. It would be terrible if the dysfunction of childhood made me have a stroke in my early old age. A new car sounds so much better. I'm really enjoying looking for one. I've decided on a ruby Hyundai Sonata. They are pretty and affordable (if there is any such thing when it comes to cars).

I've also started thinking about life after caregiving. I saw a house that you could see from the front to the back through the big windows. It was so light and airy and clean. I thought about my own new place with very little furniture, a lot of floor, and a lot of light in a senior community where someone else does all the maintenance. :)

Jo--- Just wanted to stress my thank you to you for your advice yesterday.. It began really good!.. lasted for about 30min. before the bomb dropped and I was taking blood pressure ect.. (as I mentioned in my post).. But regardless of how it ended up.. I do appreciate it!! Have a nice day.. you are a special lady

I do wish I had the ability of not being affected by my reactions..or comments.. Jessie you are so right the emotional energy it takes to confront hurtful words or actions is not worth it..but yet it is so hard... Yesterday I tried to focus on the wonderful advice Jo gave me.. To do one thing for me.. so I decided to put all my energy into getting creative in the kitchen... While I was trying to make a peaceful day.. My mom decided to call my one sister.. well long story short.. the phone conversation turned into a arguement.. every now and then my mom will see what horrible people my sisters truly are.. so of course,following the call my mom was upset..her blood pressure went up..she was a wreck physically and emotionally.. and all for me to "make better".. I had to put aside what I was doing to calm her down..talk and talk.. but I could not hold back.. I told her all will be fine with you and your beloved daugters in a few days and no matter how much they hurt you I'm left to clean it up.. This made her very angry.. as this comment usually does.. But I am tired of being the one to calm mom down while they go on with life.. but she will continue to call them.. because in her words.."they are my daughters".. It's not fair.. I have zero contact with my sisters.. because they contribute nothing positive to my life..but indirectly I am forced to deal with them because mom lives with me.. From the age of 10 all I wanted to do is to get my mom (and me) away from my sisters.. and when I finally do I see she is the one that won't let go... I told her one day you will end up having a stroke..or worse.. all for them.. but I've said this before and nothing changes.. my mom is very emotional and the upset they create makes her sick.. I cannot keep living my life fixing their damage.. but I have to.. I'm stuck just as I was as a 10yr little girl.. funny how lifes pattern never really changes.. I wish everyone a day filled with the Love we do deserve......

Izabella - how did the time-for-you cooking go? Waiting to hear! :)

(((((jessiebelle)))) right on!!! and good for you austin - figuring out a way that works.

I am older than you are, and I do appreciate what you say about stress and self preservation. Things used to bother me for days too. In the past few years it was affecting my health to the point that I knew I had to make changes. Even now, I am struggling with some health issues that must be, at least in part, rooted in a lifetime of stress. Thankfully they aren't life threatening. This past summer I made the decision to finally detach. I had distanced (given myself space) before but not detached. I think it is self preservation. I had some anger and lots of hurt to do with my mother and my sister. It is amazing how it can be like water off a duck's back, once you get into the "right" frame of mind,

Hugs to both of you and gave a good day

Joan

195Austin, it feels better. The first nip was still hurtful. Not long ago if she had said that, it would have chewed at me for days. I was just hurting myself feeling all that anger. I wonder if a lot of the change in the way I am feeling is self preservation. Now that I'm older, all that stress and anger were probably going to kill me.

Jessie that was great I have to learn to do that when visiting my Mom-lucky for me when I visit I now stay with my sister and only see Mom with others present and she plays the sweet old lady role she is so good with doing. But instead of stewing over what someone says I will put it behind me fast and see how that goes.

What can you say about dysfunctional families? Today I was cleaning my car. It is 9 years old and leaks in a couple of places. I'm always having to clean up the water after it rains. And it is forever raining here.

Today I came in and said I thought it was time to buy a new car. My mother said right away that they could not help me with buying one. I didn't ask them and don't need any help there, but it did stir up some feelings. My parents never gave me anything. They paid for my brothers' college, but I paid for my own. They saved money for their grandkids' college. They gave thousands and thousands of dollars to my oldest brother. They invested so much in the sons, but I was left to fend for myself when it comes to finances.

My first thought was to tell her what a rude remark it was to make to someone who has given them over two years of her life with no thought of pay. My second thought was that it didn't matter. My mother is stuck in that old mindset that boys matter and girls are only good for breeding and cleaning. I'm not going to change her now.

If she's lucky I'll let her ride in my new car. That I was bothered by it and put it behind me so fast made me proud. I realized that it didn't matter and I certainly was not going to put any emotional energy into it.

"She let go" was so good emjo, so simple, just let go... thanks,,, hugs to you

Izabella, my wife was more her mother's substitute spouse like you describe and so was I as the only child of a single mom.

Jo, thanks for sharing that poem.

That poem is very true. We must face the reality of the pain and then let it go. Some, like myself, write a letter expressing our pain, read it aloud, burn it in a safe container while praying a prayer of release into God's hands, and then throwing the ashes to the wind.

for Izabella, ladee, cmag and all of us here dealing with dysfunctinal family issues

it touched me...

She let go

She let go. Without a thought or a word, she let go.

She let go of the fear. She let go of the judgments. She let go of the confluence of opinions swarming around her head. She let go of the committee of indecision within her. She let go of all the ‘right’ reasons. Wholly and completely, without hesitation or worry, she just let go.

She didn’t ask anyone for advice. She didn’t read a book on how to let go. She didn’t search the scriptures. She just let go. She let go of all of the memories that held her back. She let go of all of the anxiety that kept her from moving forward. She let go of the planning and all of the calculations about how to do it just right.

She didn’t promise to let go. She didn’t journal about it. She didn’t write the projected date in her Day-Timer. She made no public announcement and put no ad in the paper. She didn’t check the weather report or read her daily horoscope. She just let go.

She didn’t analyze whether she should let go. She didn’t call her friends to discuss the matter. She didn’t do a five-step Spiritual Mind Treatment. She didn’t call the prayer line. She didn’t utter one word. She just let go.

No one was around when it happened. There was no applause or congratulations. No one thanked her or praised her. No one noticed a thing. Like a leaf falling from a tree, she just let go.

There was no effort. There was no struggle. It wasn’t good and it wasn’t bad. It was what it was, and it is just that.

In the space of letting go, she let it all be. A small smile came over her face. A light breeze blew through her. And the sun and the moon shone forevermore.

Ernest Holmes

cmag I appreciate that you wrote "While this might sound harsh and a path toward being a calloused person, I find this is how I become more and more seasoned instead of becoming more and more hardened out of bitterness and resentment toward others which in the long run only hurts me."

I find the same. I know to some drawing firm boundaries may sound harsh, but exhaustion, bitterness, resentment etc are harsh too and draw a person down. We do have limits to what is good/healthy for us. Those with personality disorders are unable to repent I think - they truely do not recognise what they do to others. I forgive, as scripture says I should, and for my own good, not because the other asks for it.
Distinguishing between the "real" needs and crises, as opposed to the narcissistic manipulations takes some practice. In my mother's case many, if not most of the fusses in her life have been narcissistic crises - one's she has created. I am learning not to get hoovered into them.

I am going to post a poem I found called "She let go". It could as well be "He let go". I found it useful.

Our current situations are very much influenced by our childhood experiences -from which many of us are still healing. I am the younger too, but expected to take more responsibility, and supported my dad through his difficulties with my mother - I understand that well. These patterns become ingrained early, and we have to work hard to replace them with healthier patterns, I love cooking too - for me it is a creative thing - so I do wish you lot of luck and fun and enjoyment of your efforts. It is never too late to walk a different path. Yes - keep telling yourself the truths about yourself - you are beloved of God and He does have answers for you. Don't respond if the guilt buttons get pushed by your mum - just keep on with your plans no matter what she says, or if she crys or sulks. That;s called manipulation. There ia a great website about "daughters of narcissistic mothers." If you google that phrase, you will find good resources (((((((((hugs)))))) jo

This site has not just helped me w/trying to find a new approach in dealing w/my mom.but also at the same time dealing w/ very sisters.. Jo.. Your comment regarding what was my childhood.. you are so very right.. since I can remember I was always more of a spouse to my mom then a daughter.. Now don't get me wrong..she cared for me if I was ill as a child..but emotional support she would tell me "you are such a strong person.." I would help her w/problems w/my sisters from the time I was young(and I am the youngest).. and when I would go on a date..I felt guilty leaving mom if she was upset from one of my sisters.. so I would cancel..or come home early.. So..thank you for opening my eyes..and do some some soul searching.. and as far as me time..today I am cooking..for me it relaxing..but it's not easy because mom feels I am not including her.. So..wish me luck.. and cmagnum--your powerful words I need to really print..and re-read them at least 100 times a day.. ladeeda-- I wish you a beautiful day..you are so far from being a "stupid" person.. not even close...

I think there are four sentences that we need to say out loud until they sink into our heads. 1. I did not make the person I am are caring for the way they are. 2. I cannot control their illness. 3 I cannot fix their illness. 4. I can choose a healthier path for myself and seek to stay on that path.

For me, the statements above help us detach from the sick drama that dysfunctional people want to hoover us into. They want us to dance their dance. They want us to feel guilty for how they are. They want us to feel obligated to fix what only they can fix. They want to control us by tricking us in trying to control their dysfunctional personality disorder. Generally speaking, this is how people with a narcissistic, borderline or histrionic personality operate.

We can't change them, but we can detach with love so that we are dealing with what is the real crisis of their life without getting hoovered into their drama.

While this might sound harsh and a path toward being a calloused person, I find this is how I become more and more seasoned instead of becoming more and more hardened out of bitterness and resentment toward others which in the long run only hurts me. Waiting for others to repent is a waste of my energy that can be better spent.

May we all find more and more freedom from being hoovered into the dark side of dysfunctional personalities knowing their basic hoovering techniques are Fear, Obligation and Guilt, the three tools of emotional blackmail.

(((((Izabella)))) You have to practice your "no" muscles - they get stronger as you use them. You don't have to say it to her - or you can - but in your head anyway, to the endless demands and misery. If your mum has been negative all her life you probably have to grieve that - it is a loss of a "normal" childhood, You deserve a good portion of your life, for you, and to make it good for you. I know you can do it - give to yourself what you have been giving to your mum - I know you will appreciate it more than she does. Believe me she will manage - she may ramp up her attempts to get you to center on her, but resist them, eventually she will respect your boundaries better, if you keep them firm.
ladee - old triggers for parental approval it sounds like - know that one well - good to ID it and put it where it belongs - out of your life. I am sorry for Marie and maybe she isn't feeling well which makes her worse, but we all have choices ...

love
jo

There may not be happiness where your mom lives in her head, and it has been proven over and over again, we can not MAKE anyone else happy.... by you pouring all your energy into an unwilling bucket, you have deprived yourself of your OWN happiness..... hopefully you will find a way to start getting your power back from this very unhappy person.... maybe some counseling for you is in order....I have found myself in the past few days being depressed because I am back to square one with Marie, so your post was a great reminder for me.... had you not shared what was going on with you, I would have spent a weekend being miserable over many things I have no control over.... I can't make Marie happy, she is negative, controlling and downright hateful sometimes... what is being triggered in me is the ole " you are stupid" feelings.... her saying it doesn't make it so.... so thanks again for sharing..... you have helped me today.....
emjo, love ya and miss ya....
cmag hope you and your new theapist are doing some good work.... this job is hard enough without our brains being scattered all over the past....
hugs to everyone...

Jo-- Thank you.. Im gonna try it.. it wont be easy.. because mom is so very consuming.. but I will take your thoughtful advice.. (I truly do appreciate your words).. I'll let ya know later how it went..

(((((((Izabella))))) I don't think for a moment that God is telling you to give in to unhappiness. But maybe He is telling you to stop focussing on trying to make your mum happy. No one is responsible for any one else's happiness - You CAN'T make any one else happy - they can only do that for themselves. I hear that you have tried everythying you can to make her happy and it isn't working. She does sound narcissistic - and what they want is not happiness - they seem to get satisfaction out of misery, hegativity, and complaints, and want everyone's life to revolve around them. It sounds like your life does revolve around your mum. I don't think God gave us each a life to have it revolve around any other person. All those things you have tried to make your mum happy - could you try some of them for yourself - to make yourself happy? Do one positive thing for yourself today and come back and tell us what you did and if it helped to make you happy. Your mum is going to be as miserable as she wants to be, no matter what you do. That's my experience anyway. (((((hugs to you))))))
Izabella does matter!
jo

I have to log on to this site to feel like I matter..to have someone ask me how I am.. I prayed before getting out of bed today that God would bless this day with peace and happiness.. well.. as soon as I opened my bedroom door I knew God once again was not listening.. My moms first words to me were how terrible she slept.. My resonse was are you not feeling well? She says its just everything..(everything meaning she is not happy w/her new life).. I have spent 10months talking and talking to my mom..trying so hard to make her see that at 82 her life is not so horrible.. but my mom has always been a very negetive person and now it is just multiplied that she no longer is in her home doing every aspect of life her way.. I just have no energy left to try to make her happy.. It kills me because she will call my selfish sisters and have a lovely conversation while I get this end of her.. and I pray and pray for God to step in.. he knows more then anyone that I am at my wits end.. but everyday begins the same..and everyday I spend the same... talking and talking.. I have tried taking her to a therapist but she felt he was sarcastic because he asked her "doesn't anything make you happy"?? So..we never went back to him.. I've tried being completly honest w/mom and telling her you had your life at my point to live your life..ect..and she gets it for that day..and she is full of I'm sorry's ect..then the next day..we are back to making mom happy.. My whole house is based upon what kind of mood she is in.. and if I get aggravated then we argue.. and I feel bad because she cries about what her life is ect.. God knows I am out of ideas.. Ive tried finding her a hobby.. she likes nothing.. I believe with all my heart the only thing that would make her happy is if my one sister whom shes always had a soft spot for would move in her home with her.. and since that would never happen because that sister (as the other 3) do not want to be bothered w/her.. So..in reality maybe God is trying to tell me to stop looking for happiness and give in to misery.. I hate to sound so negetive..It is so not me.. but how do you find positive when there is none?? My wishes for everyone dealing w/this lifestyle is to have what I prayed for today.. Peace and Happiness..

I felt much better when caring for my husband I decided it was not my job to make him happy. Burn check your hospitals many have support groups for caregivers if not see if your local library would give you a room say once a month to meet and post it on the bullitin board. I joined one at our hospital and it was amazing. I believe there is payback-it is judgement day -we will have to account for our actions here on earth. In my own life I have seem people who were sitting pretty and were mean to me-and heard years later their perfect lives became very hard-one manager was demoted after I presented things I had written at my exit interview when I left work.

HI all...ok today has been a lil calmer and not so rough except hubby's heart rate went up to 219 and then came down...I believe I will be told he may have congestive heart failure....runs in his family. My daughter and my son need me...so I have to learn to get off the comp and learn to manage relationships with the kids and my husband. I wish that God does payback those who fail to reason and see what is truly going on. I am not sure if the kids will understand all of this or hold it against me. I am tired of screaming and yelling..I am tired of feeling empty. I am tired of the fact that I think I am losing empathy as a mother and a wife on so many levels its scary..How can a person adjust thru this stage in life and make it work but i do...I feel more like fly than angel and less than angel more like a spider waiting to eat the fly...I recently posted on the community page about arranging something for caregivers etc and support grp type deal cuz i know there is more like me in this town if only we can get a companion to sit with the ones we love then maybe it will work. I am mentioning it to my therapist cuz I am tired of not having a real face to face with someone. I am hanging in there...I just do not know if my heart can continue but God still shows me small things...and I like looking forward to those..

Emjo (and anyone else interested)...hubby found the "Screwtape Letters" on Amazon in the electronic books section. I got it for my Kindle, but they may have a version for the computer and/or a hard copy. It also had a "speech" by Screwtape to a graduating class of young demons. Believe this was written a couple years later than the original letters.
Yes, my mother was narcissistic. Once the "light bulb" went on I just thought self-centered and selfish. To the outside world she was helpful, apparently caring and loving. To her family??? My poor dad really had a tough time over the years, because nothing he did suited her idea of what he should do. But to this day, he will not hear a word against her. He was her caretaker right to the very end. Even at a distance I could sense his bewilderment at some of her words and behaviors as she slipped deeper into dementia (probably ALZ). Wish I had known this site during that time, because I might have found some words of encouragement and/or explanation for him.

MarjRob, thanks and I want to add one more aspect of feeling abandoned by God or feeling like God has turned his back on us. Read the psalms and several of them contain statements of aching souls asking the same type of question and see where the psalmist ends up. These same psalms are useful for praying about our feelings of abandonment.

love, hugs and prayers to all and to all a good night!

Thanks, Marj. Your mother is narcissistic? It explains a lot doesn't it? Knowledge can truely be power.

So many have read the Screwtape Letters. Now I am going to have to reread it. - one of my fav books in my early 20s. Where did you find it to download? Don't post an exact URL as it will be deleted.

I love the writings of C.S.Lewis.
Quote "You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body."
"Failures are finger posts on the road to achievement."

I found some quotes on detachment - Detach yourselves and take on wings (St. Frances Xavier Cabrini)
He who would be serene and pure needs but one thing, detachment. (Meister Eckhart )

and one very relevant to our topic here

The monsters of our childhood do not fade away, neither are they ever wholly monstrous. But neither, in my experience, do we ever reach a plane of detachment regarding our parents, however wise and old we may become. To pretend otherwise is to cheat. (John le Carre)

I find that detachment like forgiveness, is an ongoing process, not a destination.

Codependency is at the other end of that stick - where the relationship with another (toxic) person becomes more important than getting one's own needs met. ( a simple definition, I know, but one many of us wrestle with, especially in the world of caregiving.)

TDennard -such a very heavy load. There is a young woman with a husband and a 5t yr old on another thread who wrestles with caring for her dad which she shares with her sister. here is no doubt that it cuts into family time seriously, as does the worry of it all.

Izabella - Yes you do matter! Life is not fair. My mum is always concerned about my sis's health, and makes excuses for her, but does not acknowledge that I have health issues, and still expects me to do things for her that I can't. Please do look after yourself as well as possible. You deserve as much care as you give others. God says to love your neighbour as yourself. (not more than) - your neighbour in this case being your mum. What will happen if you stop doing some of the running around - like checking mum's house daily. If it is not necessary, you CAN say NO to her. It is wearing you out trying to meet her every wish. Please consider what you think is responsible - both to her and to yourself. My mother would have me occupied many hours a day - even though she is in another city (her choice) in an ALF - she tries to enmesh me in her every thought, concern, fear etc. One day I was on email with her from 7:30 in the morning to 3 in the afternoon over endless requests, concerns, demands. Once I retired last year, it all escalated and she felt all my time and energy was hers. I was in tears, and my stress levels was way too high from these daily email sessions -up to and over 20 sometimes. I started having PTSD flashbacks to childhood and I knew I had to change something. So I went for counselling and started emotionally detaching, and separating her "narcissistic" crises from the real ones. In fact she hasn't had any "real" crises. I have refused to respond to the narcissistic ones, and they have slowed down. Whether it is narcissim or dementia of some sort, that person should not be the one who is in charge of your time and energy - you should be - making your own assessments of what needs to be done and decisions. Can you cut out the tasks that are unnecessary? Mum may get a bit upset, but I think if you set boundaries and are firm with them, she will likely adapt. You need boundaries for your own health and also the big responsibility of your family and your son's health. Let tomorrow be a new day - and an easier one for you.

Everyone - so good hearing from you - there is no doubt that sharing this journey makes it more bearable.
love. hugs and prayers ♥♥♥
jo